Opposing participation in war under any circumstances 30 out of 74 present at the meeting of the Debating Union last night went on record as pacifists after a spirited discussion in which the minority used pugnacious methods of argument to express its pacifistic principles.

Three votes-were taken. By the first, cast by the full house at 8.30 o'clock the resolution "Resolved: That no individual should, under any circumstances, participate in war" was defeated 44 to 30; the second taken on the same resolution after a portion of the house had left, was a tie, 28 to 28; the third carried 29 to 13 to measure, "Resolved: That, in the opinion of this house, the Military Science Department of Harvard University should be abolished."

Enthusiasm Pervades Meeting

The meeting was the most spirited in which the Debating Union has yet assembled. Men were completely carried away in their enthusiasm for their own stand or in the eagerness with which they refuted their opponents. Words flew back and forth with great rapidly. Seats were changed as some speaker reached an eloquence that convinced those who were not convinced before. Applause alternated with laughter, vigorous language with persuasive.

Discussion Continued After Closure

So great an interest was attained in the subject that the motion to continue the discussion after the arrival of the closure hour of 8.30, was unanimous. Then was cast the first vote, later the second, and at 9.20 the climax of the evening was reached with the proposal and adoption of the resolution that henceforth there be no military instruction at Harvard.

Floor Open After Prepared Speeches

From the affirmative side the question was upheld by C. T. Lane '26, Sterling Dow '25, and C. R. Brooks '26. Opposing them were Francis Birch '24, A. D. Phillips '26, and Oliver La Farge '24. Following the prepared addresses the floor remained open for discussion for the rest of the meeting.

The negative side held that if the United States were to disarm, it would not necessarily mean that a wave of pacifism would sweep over the world. "We are exerting pressure on no one," said Birch, the first negative speaker. "Therefore, if we disarmed, no European nation would be benefited, while the weaker American nations would be deprived of our aid. The pacifist bases his present stand on conditions which will not exist for centuries. War will continue, until the people are educated against it from the cradle up."

Says War Will End Civilization

The affirmative interrupted, "Why not begin now?"

Birch retorted, saying, "If we are not prepared for defense, there may be no cradles to begin with."

The affirmative predicated that the next war will finish civilization, and that if pacifism takes root in the United States, it will spread all over the world. "There is a bigger thing now than national patriotism", said one of the speakers from the floor. "The time is ripe for starting a movement for pacifism, and the best place to begin is at home and at Harvard."

"We have to develop relations between nations, so that peace can be assured" the affirmative continued. "Pacifism is a doctrine, a philosophy in itself, not only to be carried on in war time but in peace time as well."

Carry Motion Against R. O. T. C.

The motion was made from the floor that the Military Science Departments be abolished at Harvard, Because it stands for war preparations. After a hurried discussion the motion was carried.

The meeting was attended by members of the Military Science Department, the Liberal Club, and the political clubs of Harvard. Colonel W. S. Browning, head of the Harvard unit of the R. O. T. C., was a silent spectator at the meeting. He attended in civilian clothes